[dvnr] Fwd: The Source - April Andover Norton Newsletter
Frank Mohr
SgtNorton at comcast.net
Thu May 2 08:48:00 EDT 2019
Sent from my iPhone
Begin forwarded message:
> From: Andover Norton Newsletter <newsletter at andover-norton.co.uk>
> Date: May 2, 2019 at 6:01:08 AM EDT
> To: <sgtnorton at comcast.net>
> Subject: The Source - April Andover Norton Newsletter
> Reply-To: sales at andover-norton.co.uk
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> Sorry for another belated "Source". After a hectic March, April seemed equally busy so far so I had little time to get a new “Source” together.
> Add to it the first race meeting this season is on the first weekend in May and, as usual, my engine man Rudi sat on various things to do till this week. I have spent this weekend in the workshop, getting the 1960 30M Manx and the 750 “Thruxton Club Racer” ready for Pannoniaring.
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> So what is new?
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> MD Candidate
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> First, we interviewed three candidates to follow Phil when he retires, to my great regret! from his post as MD. We found two candidates who were so close we had great difficulty to decide whom to give the job. In the end we decided Karl Smith was the man for us, but, as Phil wrote, “it was probably with the greatest regret in my life to turn the other candidate down”. As the headhunter said: “Why don’t you employ both?”
> Karl plans to be at our Open Day on 25th May to see the owners of Andover Norton, as our whole family will be there as usual, so you may have a chance to meet him. Karl has managed a bus company with 60 buses so should probably laugh about the amount of red tape that seems to be the rule with British companies. Our Ashley believes this is all the EU’s fault but from experience I can tell him we don’t have anything like the amount of government regulations to watch in my part of the EU. Nothing to do with the EU I am afraid, so do not expect any of that red tape getting removed with Brexit!
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> New Projects
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> Two of the main projects on the go are new Commando oil tanks and new inner primary chaincases for 850Mk3s.
> The press tools for the oil tanks have been made and first pressings to be checked and completed into oil tanks are expected shortly.
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> The Mk3 inner chaincases, a project Ashley inherited from our retired buyer Pete, is far more complicated than we thought. Which probably explains why the project came to a halt after the castings were done in Pete’s era.
> Ashley explains:
> The MK3 inner chaincase 06.6023 has been cast and machined. The first attempt highlighted that the case needed different hole datums for different reasons. This was also found on the outer chaincase when this was machined. It is believed that the different datums related to different jigs used at various stages of manufacture back in the 70’s. This was further complicated by the fact that hole positions and layers machined through the case were taken from different faces and datum centres. With modern CNC machinery these datums needed to be linked and machined in few as possible ops.
> When the second attempt was fitted, it all went together but there was some clearance issues. Looking at the drawing it became clear that with 17 changes on the drawing during the lifespan of the MK3 the engineers in the day either did not understand fully the problems they were experiencing in use or they lost track of changes and what each one was supposed to overcome.
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> (Copy of the list of changes on the drawing)
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> As been mentioned elsewhere, reverse engineering is possible, but what amendment state would you be reverse engineering – you could inadvertently reverse in a dangerous fault that was on an early version of an item. Yes, reverse engineering works and is very accurate, but it leaves many unknowns and issues that would still need to be overcome on the part being made.
> With the inner chaincase now fitted, I needed to establish how to create the clearance needed and maintain all other clearances involved, ie to Swingarm, to primary chain to case and to idler gears, stator outrigger piece. Looking at the drawing there were areas I could move and others I could not, and with the latest drawing amendments dated mid-75, I doubt if these ever made it to production and thus came with unknown risk. The best one fixed point is the gear, crankshaft. In an ideal world this would make an ideal datum to work from, but is not that easy, Crankshaft end float, tolerances in the face of the DS crankcase, tolerances in the DS end of the crank, and the starter drive chain itself all need to be considered.
> The hole centre relationship was overcome early on in this project, but the layers through the cases needed more thought. With the drawing, a bike, an old known used chaincase of amendment state unknown, it took some time to unravel where it needed to be machined from and how the two datum faces related to each other. Hopefully the next case will be fitted and tested in anger, prior to the machining run.
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> So you see even with the original drawing things can get complicated, and reverse engineering- often seen as the way to go on various forums- could land us with parts that fit anything but a Norton.
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> Another major project is also on the go and we hope we can show you first prototypes at our Open Day!
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> Our Bikes:
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> Ashley’s MK3:
> My daily MK3 is doing just that, with just an oil change and a sprag clean all is well. The sprag after much use last year would not work. When stripped there was nothing wrong except that the oil around it had not suffered well from all the use and turned into a burnt, thick grease substance locking up the sprag. A quick clean in petrol and all was well.
> Over the winter the fuel tank was swapped over as the dreaded MK3 Interstate tank front stud failure cropped up on the other side, so this was welded back into position using putty to protect the surrounding paintwork, Strangely, the pre-MK3 interstate tank that is now fitted actually fits better than the correct interstate tank – another step backwards for the MK3 NVT Tipex project it seems.
> The next jobs to be done are the battery, now suspect and the tyres. As much as I like the Roadriders in the dry, I find they are not quite as good as the Roadrunners in the wet and the mileage is not great from them. With advice from Avon, some testing with tyre pressure did make a big difference to wear rate, but they are now at a point where change is needed. The plan will be to fit and test Conti Classic attacks, these are dedicated front and rear fitments and we have been advised that they suitable for WM2 rims and transform the handling, some may query the WM2 fitting, but they have been track proven on WM2 rims. Being dedicated fitments they should also perform a little better in the wet and last longer.
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> Joe’s SOR:
> My friend Guenter, besides rebuilding his own Commando from a “Coffee Roaster” (Cafè Racer) back to a grown-up’s bike, has been working on my Signal Orange Roadster with me passing through the workshop giving occasional assistance and dispensing advice between packing parcels. The primary, leaking for most of last season, came off and was properly bolted back to the crankcase- the bolts had loosened a bit in the 18k miles since my rebuild. Testing it in a few rides since everything is now fine and the leak has stopped now.
> Katrin visited her parents recently and we took the opportunity to ride together, her on the 1999 “C652 Combat” prototype we keep as a reserve bike in the shop. Hard to believe it is now twenty years ago since we built it for “Norton Motorcycles International, Inc” who had given up hope for the “Norton Dementis V8” to ever work and become a feasible motorcycle. In desperation they asked me to come up with something they could enter the market with. We were allowed 120 days to make a modern variant of our “C652 International” and that is what we did. A few weeks before we finished the project “Norton Motorcycles International, Inc.” were bankrupt
> and the bike remained a one-off prototype. Styling was by John Keogh who had at one time, years earlier, also worked on the “Dementis”!
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> Other matters:
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> My old friend and once my able assistant in my very first shop “Rockerbox” in Hamburg, Uwe “Rudi” Rudisch, sent me a copy of the “John Player Norton Press Book” When I told him I had never seen it before he said “I never thought I could give you Norton literature you don’t already have!”
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> Interesting in this book that must have come out during the 1973 season is a section about Dennis Poore after all the usual suspects- Team boss Perris, Peter Williams, Dave “Crasher” Croxford and Mick Grant- have been covered.
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> Calling Dennis Poore “Mr Norton” was not very original. I am sure everybody who ever played a role in the Norton scene was called that at one time or another. Poore is described as a great racing enthusiast who backs his team in successes and disasters. Quite contrary to what Peter Williams told me when I asked him about Poore: “He was approachable and nice when I was successful, but not if I wasn’t!”
> At the end of the Press book all mechanics are covered and youthful pictures of our locals Norman White and Basil Knight as well as the late John McLaren are included.
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> The “R”-Type:
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> Simon Amos has researched the “R” type and you find his fascinating account below. The “R” was the late Bob Trigg’s perfect answer to the call for a more “conventional” motorcyle after the 1968 model. Which was just called “Commando” in the records, not “Fastback”, a name that most likely was introduced when the “R” came out to differentiate. How right the “R” was can be seen in that the “Roadster”, incorporating the main design features of the “R”, remained in the Norton program until the last Commandos were built in 1977. Fastbacks did not really sell that well, looking too unconventional, a fact mercifully forgotten because most people now, decades later, recognize it as the design icon it is.. The “R” must have helped sales, as did the later “S” and “SS” models that adapted and modified the “R” styling.
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> The Commando ‘R’ type
> The Commando 'R' Type was introduced in early 1969. Destined for the Canadian and USA markets, it had high bars, a small 2.25 gallon petrol tank and was available in blue or red. It had a conventional dual seat unlike the Fastback, but in other respects was similar to the first Commando.
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> Andover Norton have searched the factory records to establish how many ‘R’ types were built and where they were shipped.
> The records show motorcycles were produced over two separate periods: the first from January to July 1969 and the second from February to April 1970.
> The factory documents indicate that 585 ‘R’ types were manufactured. However, due to the quality and completeness of the original files, we cannot be 100% sure.
> The first 59 bikes were sent to Canada in late January 1969 aboard the Canadian Pacific vessel “Beaverash”. Their destinations were Chariot Cycles at Winnipeg and Firth Motorcycles in Toronto. The lowest numbered motorcycle in these two batches was 130148.
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> The vessel “Beaverash” made two journeys to Canada with Commando ’R’ types.
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> The lowest numbered ‘R’ type was 129928. However this was not shipped until late March 1969. It is apparent from the records that a lower or higher frame/engine number is not a good indicator of age. i.e. bikes were not built or shipped in number sequence.
> The first USA bound bikes, 72 in number, were shipped to the Norton Villiers Corporations in Los Angeles and Seattle in late February 1969, aboard the vessel “Brasilia”
> Detailed shipping entries exist for the first production period. The number of bikes shipped by month were:
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> A second batch, built over the period February to April 1970, totals 88 machines. Detailed shipping entries don’t exist, only their distributor destinations: 68 went to the Berliner Corporation, New Jersey and 20 to NVC, Los Angeles.
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> Just 3 bikes appear to have remained in England: 132479 to Wilf Green, Sheffield, May 1969, 130898 to ‘Continental Cars’ in September 1969 and 130387 to Ian Kennedy, London in October 1969.
> The ‘R’ type is undoubtedly a rare motorcycle, accounting for less than 1% of total Commando output. If you have one and wish to share its story and photos please let us know!
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> Ilir Ohri’s superbly restored ‘R’ type is numbered 129928. It was shipped in April 1969 to S & G Firth, Toronto.
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> Gerry Lavender bought 130811 unseen and was expecting an ‘S’ type. He converted it back to an ‘R’ type with a deviation to the later timing cover.
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> 130373 (above) was shipped to Edmonton in January 1969 and 130201 (below) went to Winnipeg in February 1969. Both returned to England in 2016.
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> Customer’s Bikes:
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> The “Norsaki”
> A bit controversial perhaps, given the chassis looks remarkable original including the tinware, but we thought this bike owned and built by Kevin Lemire might be of interest. He sent us the pictures and wrote:
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> This story really has three parts: One: the rolling Norton chassis, Two: the powerplant, and Three: the build.
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> Part one: So, how does a bike like NorSaki evolve? It is the result of a confluence of events that put this machine into my life. In the beginning my friend Richard assembled a 1960 Norton Dominator rolling chassis in pursuit of his dream to build a Triton. Slimline featherbed frame, road holder front end, wheels, fenders, tank, seat, and other bits came together awaiting the donor Triumph engine. He powder coated the frame gray, had the tank painted, and basically made the machine ready to receive an engine. Unfortunately, my friend developed medical issues that now prevent him from using a clutch or handling a larger machine. I purchased the rolling machine with an eye to creating something different, I just needed a power plant.
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> Part two: I have owned a 1969 Kawasaki W2SS 650 since 1970 and have over the years collected several other W2’s. My good friend Chuck was also a W2 fan and collected several bikes, spare engines, and a good selection of spare parts. Unfortunately, Chuck developed a terminal brain condition and offered his W2 collection to me. Included in the collection were enough parts to assemble an engine and transmission, the perfect candidate for the NorSaki build. New pistons, rings, valve job, seals, gaskets, and polishing made the engine ready for transplant.
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> Part three: My goal was to build the machine without molesting the featherbed frame, in case someone in the future decides to return it to a full-fledged Norton. I templated 6 engine/transmission mounts, making three sets before I was happy with the positioning. Mounts were cut from aluminum plate and polished and shimmed until the Kawasaki drive sprocket aligned with the Norton rear sprocket. I blanked off the Kawasaki tach and speedo drives and went with a single Smiths speedometer driven off the Norton rear wheel. I disassembled the Norton wiring harness and rewired the electrics to work with the Kawasaki DC generator, solid state DC regulator, points and coil ignition, ammeter, and ignition key. Initially I installed a pair of W2 Kawasaki carbs but have swapped them out for a pair of Amal Premiers. I tried a couple different exhaust systems but have finally settled on Kawasaki W2 header pipes and a set of reverse
> cone mufflers, not yet installed.
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> The Machine rides and stops well and I am into the fettling stage at this point. It surely does invite conversation at the events I have attended with it. Thanks to Andover for supplying a number of the parts used on this machine.
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> Syd Martin’s Fastback:
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> Hi all,
> As an avid reader of your News Letter and seeing all those lovely Norton's and back stories, I thought I would share mine with you.
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> This Dec 1969 built Fastback arrived in NZ 1970 and I purchased it in 1973, the bike had been raced before I purchased it by the NZ importers in the 70/71 summer racing period before ending up in my local dealers showroom in 71. I was 16 at the time and was riding motorbikes and lusted over the Red Fastback but could never afford to buy it! Then after several quick owners it ended up back in the dealers showroom in 73, by then I was 18 and managed to buy it and have owned it ever since.
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> The early history of the bike before I purchased it, is fascinating and I have researched and recorded it for the ongoing life/history of the bike. After riding it for a few years, I decided to go racing myself, filling the thing thing up with Dunstall cam/pistons etc and had a lot of fun, somehow both the fastback and myself survived in one piece before going on to tour the whole of NZ on it until 1984 when it had a cam shaft / cam follower fail! As parts were hard to get down here in NZ the bike was put into storage and basically forgotten about, other bikes were bought and sold and life moved on.
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> Fast forward 25yrs, my son Dan who was riding motorbikes showed an interest in the old Norton in bits and packed away and rather than being left as a retirement project instead became a father son project. We started from scratch and started our association with Andover Norton in securing the bulk of parts over a number of years in the total rebuild of the Fastback, the end product is what you see here in the photos.
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> Many thanks goes to Simon and the team for the technical advice on items required I wasn't to sure on when ordering, in particular the Alton starter which was wired up for me with a Neg earth to suit the change in wiring we wanted in the rebuild. The Bike is ridden at least once a week often as a 2 up as my wife Barb (Dan's mum) often comes with me, it is used to promote the difference between the New 961 Commandos and the Commandos of 50 yrs ago in the local dealers show room, does most charity rides including DGR, featured in a couple of Bike Shows taking out best Norton.
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> It still has matching numbers, original red fiberglass tank & tailpiece, although the pin striping and Norton logos have been re done over the years.
> Having raced this and another roadster based Norton Commando in the 70 early 80's I had all my old workshop notes, special tools even hand written price list's from Mick Hemmings from when he used to send me special parts for racing way back in the day.
> The bike has been rebuilt back to std engine specs for a longer stress free life, full electronics including speedo & tach, ignition, custom wiring loom to match all the new electrical components.
> Its not the only bike in the shed but its our favorite!
> Regards
> Syd Martin
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> (Note from Joe: Before everybody complains- they weren’t pin-striped originally.)
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> Calendar Competition
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> As mentioned previously, we are still collecting entries for our 2020 Calendar Competition! So please send your quality pictures of you and your Norton to;
> newsletter at andover-norton.co.uk
> Please let us know where you are in the world and include a bit of history or the story of your bike!
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> Open Day
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> Our Open Day is fast approaching and your invited! Come meet the Andover Norton staff and owners and chat with fellow Norton riders!
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> 25th May 2019
> 9.30am - 4.00pm
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> Similar to last year, we will not be conducting any sales as we do that everyday! However you can pre-order parts up to the 22nd May and then collect on the day.
> We hope to see you there!
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